If feminism truly is a fight for “equality”, then why do feminists* hate Egalitarians so much?
Because “Egalitarianism” creates false equivalencies and ignores the underlying social scaffoldings that enforce inequalities.
One of my students (a dude, of fucking course), just to spite me…wrote an entire argumentative essay on egalitarianism. There’s was a whole lot of “sexism against anyone is baaaaaaad.” And there wasn’t a damn thing I could do about it because it was clear and well-researched.
I may take it out in the backyard later and let my dog pee on it though…
It says something about what kind of person you are that you have a problem with someone saying any kind of sexism is bad. That and letting your dog pee on student assignments.
I was making a joke with my girlfriend, who is actually actually aware of the essay in question. But thanks for butting in on the conversation, fuckface. This guy was arguing that sexism against men is a thing, and it sure as hell isn’t. Women are not in a position of power and therefore cannot be sexist against cismen.
#1. Sexism against men doesn’t exist. This can’t be said enough. You know why? Because the sexism (I’m talking about true sexism, not this “nice guy friendzone incel” bullshit) experienced by men is perpetrated by the same sexist-against-women forces that feminists (the same kind the OP is mocking) fight against. So instead of whining about “sexism of any kind,” might wanna educate yourself first.
Recommended reading: A List of “Men’s Rights” Issues That Feminism Is Already Working On
#2. You want to complain about teachers abusing students and what kind of person they are and how that correlates to sexism, why not start with the disturbingly high amount of teachers that enforce misogynist viewpoints including that the female student majoring in their class is entering a “male” field and doesn’t belong there? Or how about we go younger and talk about high/middle/and even elementary schools across the country with teachers enforcing dress codes that sexualize a girl’s body and (here is where genuine sexism involving men and where you SHOULD be protesting) enforcing the fact that boys and male teachers/staff members are predisposed to rape/sexual assault and can’t control themselves if they see a certain part of a girl or woman’s body (ANY girl or woman’s body), or even spaghetti straps.
#3. This post has been picked up by such garbage as “abuttmaleprivilege” which cries harder for heterosexual white cis men than Fox News. It has also provoked a number of the usual “Tumblr feminist” (FUN FACT: feminism, social justice, and yes, even “men’s rights activists” predate Tumblr by a looooooonnnnng time. Please stop embarrassing yourselves) accusations/whining and people smugly patting themselves on the back for their hateful beliefs based on what they think a feminist is. Here’s a few things though…
B) If anyone calling themselves “egalitarians” rather than feminists honestly thinks they support egalitarianism, here’s a newsflash: you don’t. If the idea of an historically oppressed group that continues to be oppressed is so offensive to you as a man/men that you have to pick/co-opt a new name to separate yourself from them, YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN EQUALITY FOR EVERYONE.
#1 Sexism doesn’t exist against men? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA women don’t have power you say HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! So all those female police officers, teachers, employers, guardians, administrators, managers and College professors just have zero power to exert their own biases and bigotries upon the people who are subject to said so called none existent power HAHAHAHAH!! oh wow! And let me guess sexism couldn’t possibly exist on an individual level, Theres no way individuals could be responsible for exerting sexism BECAUSE ALL SEXISM IS INSTITUTIONALIZED. Fuck me you’re so full of shit it’s spilling out all over your key board.
#2 Why the fuck are you using the misogyny in the school system to defend this bigot who is confessing to her bigotry right here on tumblr this isn’t fucking playschool, this is fucking college and she’s allowing her own sexist(YES INDEED SHE IS CAPABLE OF SEXISM) biases influence how she approaches her students. Yes there is sexism in the universities but two wrongs don’t make a right and this person is no less deplorable than the misogynists you complain about. It is peoples futures she’s dictating after all and she does indeed swing that kind of power.
And since we’re on the topic of sexism in grade schools how about we address the real elephant in the room that is the bias against boys in academic grading. I’d have to say how we grade our children is of significantly greater concern than whether or not girls are allowed to wave their cleavage around in a professional academic institution. I don’t really see how dress codes are going to affect any girls academic output it certainly hasn’t hurt japans academic output. However biases in grading DO actually affect peoples academic out put.
That’s not to say girls don’t face their own biases in grade school
But there is clearly something seriously wrong that has resulted in a steady decline in male success rate at school despite comparable test scores.
#3 what abuttmaleprivilege has said in the past, regardless of any interpreted sexism is not relevant to the current topic at hand. The only thing relevant to the topic at hand is what abuttmaleprivilege has said about the topic at hand. To say otherwise is participating in an ad hominem which is the lowliest form of debate. It says I can’t counter this persons opinion so I’m simply going to use that persons past to call in to question their character. Once again I thought we were outside of playschool. CLEARLY I WAS WRONG!
#4 I can support equality without buying in to feminism as a political movement. Feminism is built on preconceived tenants, dogma and an assumption that the grass is always greener on the other gender. Yet at the same time it has UTTERLY AND COMPLETELY FAILED to address the staggeringly high suicide, murder, assault and homelessness rates amongst men as well as a steady decline male success rates in primary education. Not only that it has completely failed to address male victims of spousal abuse who’s numbers though lower than that of women are still comparable in severity and commonality. There are a multitude of other serious psychological, social and financial issues plaguing men that feminism has only helped to toss fuel on such as unreasonable child support payments and the bias in the legal system but frankly I don’t have anymore time to waste on an ignorant piece of shit like you so here have some links and enjoy
Victims of violence
In it’s pursuit of women’s rights, feminism has completely and utterly neglected the psychological needs and wellbeing of the opposite gender all the while painting an overly simplified, biased and frankly villainous image of the male sex while also refusing to acknowledge the sexual, social and institutional pressures that women, as active members of society, exert on both men and other women.
In short go fuck yourself you smug, self-righteous sack of shit PEACE!
Normally I wouldn’t honor this type of attention-seeking garbage with a reblog, but this individual has followers who I believe have made several personal threats now (including rape threats to somethingtoobrave), and why not slap down the mosquito before you block ‘n’ ignore their bile?
Well, golly there, Morgan, you’ve certainly opened this up to reasonable and rational debate backed up with facts with that little ending. But what the hell, let’s dance.
”women don’t have power you say”
Um, no? I never said that. Oppression of group =/= don’t have power.
“So all those female police officers, teachers, employers, guardians, administrators, managers and College professors just have zero power to exert their own biases and bigotries upon the people who are subject to said so called none existent power HAHAHAHAH!!”
Once again, absolutely never said that. Relevant to this:
· straw man argument
”And let me guess sexism couldn’t possibly exist on an individual level, Theres no way individuals could be responsible for exerting sexism BECAUSE ALL SEXISM IS INSTITUTIONALIZED. Fuck me you’re so full of shit it’s spilling out all over your key board.”
Oh, you borrowed that last part from Oscar Wilde, didn’t you! Anyway, something very important:
Institutional sexism or any kind of institutionalized bigotry is not the same as discrimination. A man who is treated rudely by a woman because he is a man is not the same as a woman who makes less than 70% of what a man makes in the same position.
You get a meme that time because that is such a profoundly ridiculous accusation to make based on even just what we’ve seen here.
”this person is no less deplorable than the misogynists you complain about.”
Sigh. Let’s go through this as best as I can explain it to a reactionary troll on Tumblr who is doing this largely for attention (because people that see this reblog might not know about/can learn from this).
Number one, let’s refer back to institutional bigotry versus personal discrimination. Even if somethingtoobrave had said “I can’t fucking stand men. They’re all alike,” while that would be personal discrimination, no, that would not be as bad as the misogynists I “whine” about, as I’m fairly sure that imaginary person would not threaten men with rape and/or if they were raped, go on about how it was justified.
For those unaware, somethingtoobrave made a personal message to me on something she didn’t think would get reblogged/picked up by anti-feminist groups on Tumblr. That was her only mistake. For a background, an asshole (my word) in her class has repeatedly made sexist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, and just about every other kind of bigoted remarks one can dream up. And you know something, internet-flame-war-thrower-who-isn’t-really-reading-this-just-getting-ready-to-spew? Said dude is infamous. When she called him out for making bigoted remarks in class (not because she is an evil feminazi Tumblr Social Justice Warrior!™ but because they were clearly upsetting/insulting members of her class, including, yes, men), he reported her to the administration for “discriminating against white heterosexual men.”
So some jackass bigot holds more power than (gasp!) a female college professor just trying to make the class safe for everyone.
”whether or not girls are allowed to wave their cleavage around in a professional academic institution.”
Dressing for comfort in warm weather (most public schools in the country ban tank tops for girls from middle school up) isn’t quite the same as “waving their cleavage around” (never mind the fact that this is spreading to elementary schools). Interestingly, nearly all dress code restrictions address female students, not males. And before anyone can pipe up about how males aren’t the ones with “their bodies on display”, I can direct you to plenty of males with their underwear hanging out (I do not know why this fashion trend hasn’t died), in tank tops, and muscle shirts, that face little if any retribution from school officials for their clothing, and certainly not (as we’ve seen right here in this post!) the public shaming that female students encounter. And certainly bearing your boxers is not exactly attire for “a professional academic institution”, no?
”how about we address the real elephant in the room that is the bias against boys in academic grading”
Not sure you understand what the expression “elephant in the room” means, but let’s go.
Regarding the bias against boys in the classroom, I’m unsure why you don’t think that’s a feminist concern (actually, I’m not unsure as to why YOU don’t think it is, for reasons I’ll get into). Generally, such biases work against both genders (even if said biases initially favor the more oppressed of the two, they create a seesaw effect and work to institutionalize bigotry; see: benevolent prejudice). I hesitate to make round statements about what “all feminists” do (I know it’s shocking to someone who finds the term so offensive as to spew the bile you do, but those wearing the name “feminist” actually span the political spectrum, even on Tumblr; have a look around outside your echo chamber), but one of the most well-known feminist poems (even if people are surprised to learn it’s a feminist poem since they have the same misguided view of feminism you carry) addresses the fact that sexism affects everyone (and therefore, feminism is for everybody).
“To say otherwise is participating in an ad hominem which is the lowliest form of debate. It says I can’t counter this persons opinion so I’m simply going to use that persons past to call in to question their character. Once again I thought we were outside of playschool. CLEARLY I WAS WRONG!”
Yes, everyone reading this, this user who has flung name-calls at everyone and ended this with “go fuck yourself you smug, self-righteous sack of shit PEACE!” is actually calling out someone else for using (what they believe to be) the ad hominem argument. Are we all done snickering/shaking our heads? Okay, let’s go.
Definition of ad hominem courtesy ol’ Wikipedia: “An ad hominem (Latin for “to the man” or “to the person”), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an argument made personally against an opponent instead of against their argument.” (Sources cited because although it’s the default resource, it is Wikipedia.) You’re most welcome!
“abuttmaleprivilege” is by name (as in, the name of the Tumblr in which they reblogged that post) mocking the Tumblr that addresses and dissects male privilege (aboutmaleprivilege, for anyone that didn’t get the super-witty pun). If “abuttmaleprivilege” were a personal Tumblr (like, say, this one, or somethingtoobrave’s Tumblr) this might be a different story. However, it’s a Tumblr devoted to anti-feminism, run by several moderators (although it wouldn’t make a difference even if it was run by one person).
Your fourth paragraph, you know, the one you didn’t “have anymore [sic] time to waste on an ignorant piece of shit like [me]” (man, you must really hate ad hominem attacks), is based around one intensely flawed theory:
All feminism and anyone and anything that identifies as feminist is a part of a group think, a singular political philosophy complete unsubjective with stated laws adhered and enforced (wow, who’d have thought Sarah Palin and Kathleen Hanna even hung out together?).
This is blatantly false, as even a cursory search (warning: it will destroy your preconceived notions and the entire falsehood on which you base your “arguments”) of just this website will show you.
While, yet again, the term feminist is subjective, you’ll find that most major feminist organizations (particularly here in the blogosphere) adhere to the “third wave” principle of feminism is intersectional or it’s bullshit. They are concerned with ANY kind of spousal abuse or domestic violence, the surrounding factors of suicide (including ableism and lack of access to proper mental healthcare, classism), and the factors surrounding the phenomenon of homelessness, including racism, classism, and ableism.
While I realize these things are hard to hear when you’ve based an entire philosophy around the Rush Limbaugh cartoon nonsense propagated by the very groups people fighting for true equality OPPOSE, it’s worth doing a fact-check before you throw around the term “feminist” anymore.
”In short go fuck yourself you smug, self-righteous sack of shit PEACE!”
Wait, “in short”? As in, the summation of your entire argument? For someone who is worried about wasting time, you could’ve just cut to the chase.
Now hold on, did you misspell “piece” or did you forget to break the sentence? I’m not sure. But really,
And that’s the end of that.
Well lets start here
“Normally I wouldn’t honor this type of attention-seeking garbage with a reblog,”
My misspelling aside, What can I say the very first sentence in your response reinforced all of the observations I just made about you. A smug, self-righteous sack over flowing with shit. I have to admit I was concerned that my initial response was a little too vicious but frankly I can’t describe what a relief it is to find out my statements were completely accurate. They’re more like honest observations.
I’ll concede calling you a piece of shit is still an insult, but fankly, I just have no tolerance for people who make asinine claims like “men can’t experience sexism” HA! Fuck it still get’s me everytime.
But pleasantries aside let’s address the topic at hand
A) I’ll concede, you never did say sexism is based on power. But the common assumption that no sexism exists against men aka the assumption that women can’t be sexist has as far as I’ve ever seen it been based on the assumption that
1) Sexism requires a position of power as a form of leverage
2) Women as a demographic completely lack any power in society what so ever
Often feminists who hold this deluded mentality refer me to this popular feminist site
That said all of the careers I listed that women occupy: police officer, employer, teacher, daycare worker ect. contradict this assumption that women lack institutionalized power. So if not all women lack institutionalized power and not all men possess institutionalized power then how can the assertion that women lack the ability to be sexist against men hold any weight what so ever? The answer IT’S COMPLETE FUCKING BULLSHIT
B) I’ve never read Oscar Wilde
C) Bigot: a person who is obstinantly or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance
Aka: the college professor in question who not only feels that the clear, well researched essay of her male student warrants being pissed on by a dog because it conflicts with her world view but has also admitted that her own personal experiences justify painting half the human race with the same intolerant brush. I stand by my previous statement she is indeed a bigot and a sexist.
AND OH NO! A STUDENT REPORTED HER AND I’M SUPPOSED TO ASSUME SHE’S THE VICTIM EVEN THOUGH I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT WAS SAID IN THE INCIDENT! Students, both boys and girls, have the right to complain about their teacher, does that mean they possess more power than the teacher? NOPE! She doesn’t sound like she’s about to lose her job over the incident, probably because of that binding contract she signed. At the end of the day it’s still the teacher who holds the power to exert his or her prejudices and preference upon the class. She’s the one who holds these peoples futures in her hand, she’s the one who can ruin other people’s lives, She’s the one who can do the real damage if she should so choose to do so.
“Institutional sexism or any kind of institutionalized bigotry is not the same as discrimination. A man who is treated rudely by a woman because he is a man is not the same as a woman who makes less than 70% of what a man makes in the same position.”
Actually institutionalized sexism is the same as discrimination! There is no institutionalized legislation that states women must be paid less or that women must be discriminated against in universities likewise not all employers pay women less and not all professor are sexist. It’s the decision of individual employer and professors to exert their own prejudices upon the people who are subject to their power aka DISCRIMINATION.
Also if the wage gap really was institutionalized there wouldn’t be any penalties in place for employers who get caught discriminating against their employees now would there? Kind of doesn’t make sense to punish people for exercising an institution.
Plus here are some studies on how the so called 70 percent wage gap is actually more like an 85 percent wage gap once differences in average overtime and weekend hours are taken into consideration. Turns out some women actually want to take time out of work to spend more time with their kids WHO KNEW! And that gap is still lowering as we speak WHICH IS GREAT FOR HUMANITY BUT SHITTY FOR YOUR VICTIM COMPLEX HAZAH!
“You always hear that women earn 72 per cent of what men do. That’s probably the most commonly cited statistic on the gender gap. I always cringe when I hear that,” said Marie Drolet, senior research economist at Statistics Canada and author of a 2011 study on the wage-gap issue.
Her study found that the 72-per-cent gap has held steady since the early 1990s, after narrowing slightly in the previous two decades. That 72-per-cent figure, Ms. Drolet said, is based on a full-year, full-time salary, rather than hourly wages. When comparisons are based on average hourly wages, the gap narrows to 85 per cent.”
“somethingtoobrave made a personal message to me on something she didn’t think would get reblogged/picked up by anti-feminist groups on Tumblr.”
SHE POSTED IT ON A PUBLIC FORUM AND SURPRISE SURPRISE! THE PUBLIC STARTED DISCUSSING IT. If someone makes a comment on a public forum then it’s neither personal nor private but fair game for anyone who either agrees or disagrees. Don’t like it? Then don’t choose to post on public forums. You’re right it was her fault for posting it, it was also her fault for openly expressing sexist and intolerant views on a forum where anyone and everyone can contribute their own two cents.
“Yes, everyone reading this, this user who has flung name-calls at everyone and ended this with “go fuck yourself you smug, self-righteous sack of shit PEACE!” is actually calling out someone else for using (what they believe to be) the ad hominem argument. Are we all done snickering/shaking our heads? Okay, let’s go.”
Name calling is not an ad hominem nor does my name calling invalidate your opinion, I have links to do that for me. You considered the fact that abuttmaleprivilege’s character was merit enough to discredit the opposing opinions. Aka an ad-hominem. Unfortunately my low opinion of your character is not a valid enough reason to abandon your opinions. Your character, regardless of my opinion of it, does not make your statements incorrect. Reality, like the fact that women can indeed be sexist or your inaccurate percentage on the wage gap, or the FACT that the wage gap is only partially the result of individual employer discrimination rather than an institution discredits your statements.
“Regarding the bias against boys in the classroom, I’m unsure why you don’t think that’s a feminist concern (actually, I’m not unsure as to why YOU don’t think it is, for reasons I’ll get into).”
Why do I not think it’s a feminist issue? Because feminists have done JACK FUCKING SHIT to directly address this problem. Want to prove me wrong? Please do! In fact I challenge you to name anything, ANYTHING WHAT SO EVER that feminist have done to directly curb discrimination against boys specifically in public school. For that matter I challenge you to name any movement feminism has championed to curb the high rates of suicide, assault, murder, homelessness, grossly over charged child support payments and spousal abuse specifically amongst men. Please tell me about all the male abuse shelters feminists have founded. Oh wait! the very last men’s shelter in Canada was just closed down and it’s founder killed himself THANKS FOR THE HELP FEMINISM!
The only people I EVER see bringing up ANY of the issues mentioned above are either mras or egalitarians. I’ve never seen a feminist discuss any of the points unless it directly inconvenienced women.
How can these be feminist issues if feminist never address them, and if feminists do; PROVE IT! Because Frankly I don’t see a whole lot of feminists of any schism jumping at the opportunity.
But with that said I do hope you bestow the gracious honor of reblogging the meager response of this intellectual mosquito.
P.S WOMEN CAN BE FUCKING SEXIST just felt I had to press that point home one more time since it appears to be not so common sense
I dunno about you guys but personally any teacher talking about destroying her student’s work is someone who does not deserve a teach position. Anywhere.
I sincerely hope you don’t put your RL information anywhere because I just might have temptations to tell certain people that a teacher takes things she doesn’t agree with and gets her dog to pee on them.